tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33937439.post2824563765656595851..comments2023-04-02T00:39:16.640-07:00Comments on Stochasticactus: Jazz in the SchoolsPeter Breslinhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15466530226652452872noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33937439.post-63495467304307240242007-03-09T13:06:00.000-08:002007-03-09T13:06:00.000-08:00Hey Peter,I clicked on that NEA link. Yikes that g...Hey Peter,<BR/><BR/>I clicked on that NEA link. Yikes that guy looks like some dope who fetched donuts for Karl Rove so they tossed him in NEA. WHERE'S A B SPELLMAN?!?<BR/><BR/>He used to cover this and is exemplary with a healthy skepticism for the fossil factories, I mean music schools.<BR/><BR/>This too will pass.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18394197995097602185noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33937439.post-88507496674764457692007-02-26T17:22:00.000-08:002007-02-26T17:22:00.000-08:00thanks for visiting and commenting, Dan. I think t...thanks for visiting and commenting, Dan. I think the JALC/NEA/VERIZON curriculum does a fine job on the first 40 years of jazz, which is typical. They've done such a fine job in fact that there are some who seem to think that jazz really is dead. That it lacks current cutural relevance and is entirely a thing of the past. That it is now a repertory art form recycling various styles up to about 1960 or so.<BR/><BR/>I love the fact that you called on actual, living local musicians to develop a curriculum. There is still much happening in this music and in creative improvised and composed new music in general. It isn;t laziness that keeps it out of the spotlight but willful ignorance and self-promotion.Peter Breslinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15466530226652452872noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33937439.post-25434133985105357562007-02-26T09:17:00.000-08:002007-02-26T09:17:00.000-08:00Great discussion Peter and nice post Chris. I thin...Great discussion Peter and nice post Chris. I think George Lewis is a really important jazz historian and his angle on the AACM and their place in jazz history in his forthcoming book will add a lot to the discussion. If you seek out his essays in scholarly journals, or even the essays that he's posted on the AACM New York chapter website, he speaks very clearly on the subject. He talks a lot about the politics of being branded experimental, and the validity that white experimental music is given, the "New Music" so to speak, and he talks about the politics fo being included in the so called "Downtown Scene" in NYC.<BR/><BR/>Having been tangentially involved in the creation of a jazz curriculum myself in Chicago and having reviewed the NEA materials, I found them to be myopic but useful. Ultimately, the organization I was involved in brought in a bunch of local musicians and teachers and created a curriculum with them instead of mandating it from above. If I can get some outlines of that curriculum I'd be happy to share them.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33937439.post-67216024083153960682007-02-25T17:22:00.000-08:002007-02-25T17:22:00.000-08:00hey chris rich- thanks for that angle; I had forgo...hey chris rich- thanks for that angle; I had forgotten the aspect of the history that included the semantically depleted slick-a-phonics of Spyrogyra et al. Also, great reminder of the older players who worked with younger ones...it seems Sonny Rollins was part of this too, briefly working with OC's rhythm section. And later on, Max Roach with Braxton and Taylor.<BR/><BR/>I'll definitely take you up on lunch in Boston if I'm ever there. I used to live in Allston...almost 20 years ago.<BR/><BR/>The freejazz.org site is sometimes interesting but the reaction to my NEA post there has been extremely silly. It almost immediately devolved into an argument over the word, "Jazz," which is a distraction and a waste of time. <BR/><BR/>anyway thanks again<BR/><BR/>PBPeter Breslinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15466530226652452872noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33937439.post-26175354649083420512007-02-25T15:54:00.001-08:002007-02-25T15:54:00.001-08:00This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18394197995097602185noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33937439.post-65819427989474033752007-02-25T15:54:00.000-08:002007-02-25T15:54:00.000-08:00Peter, I saw your post in Free Jazz and figured it...Peter, I saw your post in Free Jazz and figured it would better to help out over here.<BR/><BR/>One central facet of this is that in the 60's, there were still a lot of artists living from all periods of the music.<BR/><BR/>So some of the "Avante Garde",(I like to call them 'Iconoclasts'), wanted to collaborate with the older guys and so Hank Mobley was invited to work with Archie Shepp. <BR/><BR/>Kenny Dorham was tossed onto a recording session with Cecil Taylor and Coltrane and Coleman Hawkins worked with Mingus and Eric Dolphy on Newport Rebels.<BR/><BR/>Rahsaan was a major instigator/inspiration for all this and it was a good thing for the most part proving a continuity denied at the time by worthless jazz scribblers.<BR/><BR/>The AACM also invoked elements of the long century in a lot of their work.<BR/><BR/>Baby boomer music execs like the horrific David Grusin foisted fusion off to pander to boomer rock slobs and that really made a mess of things.<BR/><BR/>It was so bad, it made Marsalis look like a savior rather than a stiff unremarkable Clifford Brown clone.<BR/><BR/>So in the recoil from the utterly crappy excesses of a spyrogyra world, Marsalis seemed to redeem an honest continuity that really amounted to tossing the baby with the bath water.<BR/><BR/>When I was a kid immersed in this stuff, I quickly concluded that the writers nearly always suck.<BR/><BR/>Instead of conveying some useful insight, they always seemed to appoint themselves as gatekeepers.<BR/><BR/>Stanley Crouch started out as a sloppy drummer from Oakland who rode on David Murray's coattails into town but then turned loopy and absurd as the leading overreactor to the spyrogyra model.<BR/><BR/>I can't blame them, a bunch of dull white guys from Berklee were hogging the limelight as panderers to dumb boomers who were cultural conservatives and demanded "accessability".<BR/><BR/>These dull jackasses from Metheney to Bob James essentially were grabbing the food off of honest jazz guys plates and leaving the crumbs.<BR/><BR/>When the fusion fart wafted away the boomers upgraded to some 1950's hard bop thing that became a fern bar fossil.<BR/><BR/>In the mean time, many of the honest players like Sam Rivers or Anthony Braxton moved to what I call an honest neo classicism shifting the ratio of improvisation and composition toward composition. <BR/><BR/>Many beautiful outcomes ensued such as the World Saxophone Quartet or Mr. Blueitt's "Clarinet Family".<BR/><BR/>No sooner had they began to recover from that then a new pile of white guy pests led by Zorn hogged the limelight again from a different angle with toxic Micheal Dorff and his Knitting Factory in the lead.<BR/><BR/>I used to present Zorn in Boston when he was still an obscure underdog record store employee, but I eventually figured out his crowd was more avid to compete than cooperate.<BR/><BR/>hey, O just started a brand new jazz blog http://brilliantcornersabostonjazzblog.blogspot.com/<BR/><BR/>Drop in if you wish and if you end up in Boston I'm buying lunch.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18394197995097602185noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33937439.post-84449895990670709502007-02-22T06:46:00.000-08:002007-02-22T06:46:00.000-08:00ha, well, okay except then (with LCJO doing either...ha, well, okay except then (with LCJO doing either my request, "Womb Waters Scent of the Burning Armadillo Shell" by Cecil Taylor or your request of Ghosts) we come perilously close to FREE JAZZ CLASSICS. which is a whole other story.<BR/><BR/>Bill Dixon? I don't think so! He needs to pay his dues with Art Blakey and Herbie Hancock first, and then win two consecutive Grammy (tm) Awards, one in jazz, the other in classical. And a Pulitzer Prize for an oratorio. I'm just taking note of the "job requirements" on the NEA/JALC/Verizon Wireless Jazz in the Schools website, in the Wynton Marsalis ad...I mean, section.<BR/><BR/>PPeter Breslinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15466530226652452872noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33937439.post-46293789039906336552007-02-21T22:37:00.000-08:002007-02-21T22:37:00.000-08:00next up, LCJO version of Ayler's Ghosts?next up, LCJO version of Ayler's Ghosts?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33937439.post-49863116313745308892007-02-21T20:56:00.000-08:002007-02-21T20:56:00.000-08:00First of all, I think it's time to hand over the l...First of all, I think it's time to hand over the leadership of the Lincoln Center Jazz Orchestra to Bill Dixon...Stanley Jason Zappahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06526308723808269327noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33937439.post-84732641365825748112007-02-20T12:31:00.000-08:002007-02-20T12:31:00.000-08:00hey- I don't know. I can't get authorship informat...hey- I don't know. I can't get authorship information from the website at the moment. I wrote a letter to the NEA this morning, though, which I also posted to www.freejazz.org (it will show up there as soon as it gets approved by the moderators). <BR/><BR/>I am tired of the mischaracterizations of the period from 1959 to now, many of which seem both willful (rather than ignorant) and pernicious. It's definitely time to set the record straight. <BR/><BR/>thanks for writing,<BR/><BR/>peterPeter Breslinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15466530226652452872noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33937439.post-19698096055880676512007-02-20T04:58:00.000-08:002007-02-20T04:58:00.000-08:00On free jazz, regarding Ornette Coleman’s music, “...On <A HREF="http://www.neajazzintheschools.org/lesson4/essay2.php?uv=s" REL="nofollow">free jazz</A>, regarding Ornette Coleman’s music, “some heard in it the influence of modern European classical music; others found it to be merely an expression of musical incompetence“. I had never realized that those were the only two readings available. Apparently reception boils down to “musical incompetence” vs. “European classical music”…<BR/>Idiots are writing these (sorry-ass-excuse-for) historiographies, right?<BR/><BR/>S, tigthe improvising guitaristhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07517613086214719180noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-33937439.post-3011166176342744552007-02-20T04:01:00.000-08:002007-02-20T04:01:00.000-08:00Euww. A smart kid is going to surmise that, if the...Euww. A smart kid is going to surmise that, if the value of <I>this music</I> came from “colleges, universities, and music conservatories” instead of “urban lofts or in experimental ensembles”, this music is boring, conformist cr*p for the parents’ generation. I certainly hope that the smart and interesting young musicians run screaming into the electronica, nu-metal, neo-punk, avant-folk arena than get roped into this….<BR/>Marsalis, a unique musician with the reverse Midas touch.<BR/><BR/>S, tigthe improvising guitaristhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07517613086214719180noreply@blogger.com